Our guest today is Juliane Hahn - she is the Founding Partner & Managing Director of Signature Ventures, which is a Venture Capital fund based in Munich that backs exceptional European teams that build the backbone of the next-generation internet: open, secure, and privacy-centered.
We speak with Juliane about her journey towards working at a VC fund, her passion for blockchain technology and the role of women in the field of Venture Capital.
Our guest today is Juliane Hahn - she is the Founding Partner & Managing Director of Signature Ventures, which is a Venture Capital fund based in Munich that backs exceptional European teams that build the backbone of the next-generation internet: open, secure, and privacy-centered.
We speak with Juliane about her journey towards working at a VC fund, her passion for blockchain technology and the role of women in the field of Venture Capital.
Juliane 5:28
Hey, hi, thanks for having me today.
Liz 5:31
Oh, welcome. We're so happy to have you here. Juliane, let's kick off as a starting point. Could you please tell us how your transition from law to venture capital investing was?
Juliane 5:43
Yeah, so of course, so the term that I use the transitioning, I would probably rather describe it as an evolution. So somehow I found my natural spot, I said, I started very early on during my studies to work in an international transaction law firm. And during my legal studies, I discovered also a big interest in entrepreneurship and particularly the innovation sector. So when I started there as a lawyer, that was just for a really brief moment in my overall career, that I really built by the hour, and making clients happy with All Things legal today. And that was basically the evolution I spoke about. I'm still applying a lot of my knowledge that I acquired back then. I would rather this private as a toolbox now. So I am still active in the legal field. But I use this toolbox in order to make what I'm really excited about. And that is building innovation ecosystems and supporting founders and building great companies that build our future.
Lieke 7:07
Yep, and Juliane, you have also worked for over four years in the corporate venturing space. And one of the positions, you also worked on new fund structures that ultimately didn't work out and its fields. Could you maybe tell us a little bit about what you learned from that experience?
Juliane 7:27
Yes, of course. So probably to begin from the start like a corporate venture, is a world of its own. So in an independent non-strategic fund, if you work with founders, and also your own investors, the interests of all involved parties are very clear. So and for investors for your LPs in the front, of course, they want the highest IRR. And founders want the best support to build a great company. And that again, results most in the most cases, and the best cases, integrate IRR for the fund and your investors. So everybody's interests are very much aligned. If you're starting to work in a corporate venture, you have to learn that there are many, many strategic interests and goals. So these strategic interests often can't be easily quantified or measured. And on top of that, you have a lot of political interests, like how long is your mandate on the board, and how fast have you shown success to the board. And then you have, of course, on top of that, a couple of monetary interests. And all these interests cannot be completely synchronous. So they are more in sync with the funders' interests. Because the founders, usually, if you pick the right ones, they just want to build a great company. And I think the reasons for my personal failure in this space was because I really tried to square the circle, I really tried to achieve an interest alignment and build a structure that basically aligned most of those interests. And that is a very complex thing to do. And I am still convinced that they are aspects of corporate venture and executed in a certain way that work. Most that I have gotten to know are somehow in the spiderweb of many different interests, interest dragging on them, so they are not capable of doing that. And that is somehow exactly what my biggest learning was, if you have no fertile soil, to build something great, you should really move on and then go somewhere where you find that soil to grow great projects. That is exactly what I had to figure out, you can't, if you just can't square the circle, it's impossible. And I also found out a lot about my person. So I really figured out that I'm a person that is very interested in the thing and not very interested in the political aspects of it.
Liz 10:40
Thanks, Juliane, I think like you say a bit about, you know, the toolbox that you've established is also the toolbox of understanding yourself. So really excellent to be able to take that experience into what you're doing now to know that you can't spread yourself too thin, but also that there are some aspects that do work from that spider web and such, you spoke to us about how you are working in something that you're really passionate about. So we understand You are the founding partner and managing director of signature ventures and perhaps you could share with our listeners what exactly it is that you do.
Juliane 11:15
So usually, the funny thing is when I look at the profile, and I talk to other people, it often sounds from the outset of the job working in venture capital, having your own venture capital fund, it sounds way more romantic than it actually is the everyday job. So I think many would be shocked how much paperwork is involved in really getting things done and our everyday job. So if I share a little bit about our everyday working inside, it is a big contrast with a few, basically compared to what the general glamorous image of venture capital out there probably is. And I hear a lot of popular investors, you know, starting their day with a full fat session of yoga and meditation, and there are a lot of movies and malls and everything is very fancy. And they're sitting in really, really nice offices, and just always meeting great people and having good conversations. But if you're still in an active position of running a fund and doing the everyday job, there's really not much time left to have a great design day. So most of the personal or my personal time, and most of the person's time of all the team members go into deal making, lots of negotiations, lots of agreements, fund administration, lots of number crunching, very precise work accounting stuff, Investor relations, really dealing with investors that even if the fund performed super well might have a bad day and might not understand the figure immediately and call you up and be upset. And then you have to explain over and over, of course, which is a vital and integral part of your job. And then of course also everything that involves building a great company. So my most important task as a managing partner is, of course, also keeping the team motivated and also connected. And increasingly, a digitized world means also when we are apart, we somehow need to stay connected. So this is, I would say a very, very broad spectrum of activities that are my everyday tasks. To me still, it is absolutely the greatest job in the world, because I know exactly why I'm doing this. But frankly, it's super hard work. So I focus on the on the fancy parts of it that perhaps most people think is the largest part of your day, and this is exactly also why I'm so terribly excited about it, is the outstanding people that you get to work with, not only on your own team, but also you need a lot of funders that build the future. And also if you speak to co investors or even our LPs, I learned I really learned from all of them. And that is as rewarding as rewarding as one can imagine. So to sum it up, I think if you sum it up to me, it's really the thing that you never get bored of. It's always exciting. But that excitement is exactly what you also need to be able to handle.
Lieke 15:05
Yeah, I can imagine and I think maybe to dive a bit deeper into the space that you're active in, I can imagine blockchain is also super exciting, because there's so much going on, changes are happening all the time. Could you maybe explain to our listeners who do not know anything about it, what this technology is, and then maybe also explain to us how this is linked to your investment thesis.
Juliane 15:34
I will probably start with explaining briefly what blockchain is. So blockchain is a form of distributed ledger technology. So from a very, very simple technological point of view, a blockchain is a ledger that contains all interactions of network interaction, I can name address actions as well. And the distributed and decentralized design makes the blockchain a very tamper proof and transparent thing to compare, especially to current centralized systems. So you have to start thinking in digital interactions and transactions that exactly only take place in that digital world, to start to pass the meaning. What we do as a fund is we are investing in broad sectors that are built around distributed ledger technology. So our fund thesis is to precisely focus on the projects that build the infrastructure and also early applications in that space. And as we are in a quite early phase, though, we are also an early stage fund. And we are, as we are really looking for the very best projects are there, we are also investing on a global level. So our deal sourcing is really International. And that is also what to circle back makes the job so exciting, because you really speak to the top hat in this space. And perhaps also to add to it, because many know that term way better. This is all linked to cryptography. So the technological basis for all of this cryptography.
Liz 17:48
Okay, and Juliane, you speak about how it is such an early stage and how I guess anything that's new is also exciting. But could you maybe share with us why you believe blockchain is such an interesting space to be in right now.
Juliane 18:05
The technical progress of those distributed networks live in their particular robustness and transparency and also openness to an advanced security. And the very exciting, interesting part about it is that this allows for real digital ownership. And that also means peer to peer exchange of value. Without intermediaries, such as a bank. For real, today, we're very much living in a world of intermediaries. In a world of accelerating digital transformation, this is exactly what marks the next inevitable step in the evolution of the entire internet. That's exactly what has, why does this have such a great impact. And this technical paradigm shift allows them for fundamental socio economical innovation through its design and to enable completely new business models. So that brings a lot of new opportunities with that.
Lieke 19:26
Yeah, and I think indeed, as you mentioned, there seems to be really a big revolution in peer to peer solutions, which offers a lot of new possibilities. And I think you mentioned before that you also see how it can help actually solve certain socio economic problems that we currently see in the world. Could you tell us a little bit about that?
Juliane 19:50
Very good question because this is again, referring to what was before, many many socio economic problems, then from necessary trust and those intermediaries that I just mentioned. So I mentioned banks, so think about the financial crisis or privacy issues and chrome privacy concerns. Everybody talks about, and many more of these trust, linked concerns, and problems. And now imagine a world with less dependence on global intermediaries. So the possibility to interact and transact, peer to peer mitigates economic monopolies that, by their design, tend to capture all the value of current exchange between parties. So if you're naming concrete examples, if you are arriving on Facebook with your friend, they capture the value that's sent from your personal exchange and the exchange of other users and monitor rise on it. And that's summed up in simple words: in distributed networks, the users themselves regain control over their data. I know this is very abstract. But I think with those examples, it's way easier to understand than if you just read basically, about the technical design of it. And this is exactly why your question about the socio economic problems that might be resolved or mitigated, so interesting.
Lieke 21:50
Yeah, I think you explained it really clearly. Thank you for that.
Liz 21:53
Thanks. And I think, you see, you know, you speak about how this is, you know, really important in the evolution of the internet. And, you know, I guess I do speak for myself when I can, you know, remember when I was a child using, you know, the dial up and listening to that kind of frequent sound, and then, you know, all of our friends kind of migrated on to Facebook. And now I think we're all realizing the consequences of having photos from our youth kind of indefinitely on and definitely online. So thanks for, yeah, giving us the imagination to think about what the future could look like. Like you say, well, we kind of are more in control of data. I'm curious to hear, you know, if this is what you're living and breathing at the moment, like, what do you see the future of distributed ledger technology? What does that look like to you?
Juliane 22:42
So I think when you referred to early attempts from the internet, that brings it on my mind that already, like the scalable infrastructure of today's internet is, is based on distributed system, which is currently very well known on if you only look at the market capitalization, and the increase of the market capitalization of some of the biggest players in the world. So it's in the hands of a few global players. And from there, the internet will gradually move to a more decentralized architecture in the future. And this, it precisely, is much more like the internet's original design idea when the internet started. So this is very interesting, because we kind of circle back to the roots a little bit.
Lieke 23:45
Yeah, and Juliane, maybe to focus, also, again, a bit more on you and your experience. I think, for many listeners, and people who know you, you can be seen really as an inspiration. And I think next through that your backgrounds can also be seen as typical in venture capital. Why do you see that having maybe a different perspective, can be a strength in your position?
Juliane 24:12
So thanks, of course, for the kind words, I'm, I really, the only idea that I have is trying to be a role model for others that want to move into space. So wherever whatever you've done before, wherever you come from, if you have a real passion, about innovation, and of course, you bring a solid toolbox in all the aspects of venture capital, dare to move in the space and do not follow a protocol. And I know a lot of people that have made excellent venture capital careers, even some of the best that would not fit the protocol precisely. So this is exactly what makes the industry stronger, different perspectives on different people, different backgrounds, shed different angles of light basically, on projects on founders, and also bring with them different approaches of dealing with innovation, and building our innovation ecosystem. I think that if you are very much biased from one practice, somehow, you are a little bit like, you tend to be a copycat of each other, right? So you come from the same business school, or you come from the same Technical University, and you have the same track record so far. So the ideas that have been planted from the outside, are fundamentally the same. So if you then shake up the space, and you admit, also on the teams that make up basically, make up the space for the individual product teams, the into the individual investor teams, to make them up by individuals that have those bit different perspectives, the exchange becomes way more vivid, and other factors become meaningful. And then you have, of course, you have to be very, very clear in sorting out those that add value, and identify those that bring you forward. But already having that different mindset is also a broad study base about it. So this is completely supported by research that brings, in general, better decision making alone. And I'm also convinced that for us, that means that because our team is built that way, that we are better in deciding about whom we're gonna invest in, and also how we're gonna support them. And also can bring different angles of support to the founders, which is one of the most important tasks of a venture capitalist. And so, from my own, from a concrete example, what we figured out is, when we have our technical, more technically focused team members focusing on more on that part, and the more venture experience, part of the team focusing on the people, if we bring that together, the discussions are usually very exciting. And it goes down in the most nitty gritty details about the fundament of the founder team. And this often brings aspects to life. That would not be discussed. If you wouldn't have that structure. This is where my deep belief that diversity brings a value comes from.
Liz 28:30
Yes, and I can see I can hear that you're passionate about it. So that's wonderful. Perhaps another thing we also know you're passionate about, about the importance of female founders. Do you think that the industry is becoming more female friendly? Your experience.
Juliane 28:48
Great question. I, personally, am not a big, bigger fan of female funders than of other funders. That is a very clear statement. Because I am a big fan of having the best people, wherever it is. So I don't want any barriers or hurdles. If you have another background, the protocol allows you to enter the space. And this is exactly what I'm fighting for, by supporting many projects and also by being a co-founder of, for example, encouraged ventures, a great association of a lot of female entrepreneurs that work together to empower female founders and provide them with investments. But it's not about selecting whoever is like people who offer a diverse background of any kind, but it's really to mitigate disadvantages that are still present in the space today. I feel that it's getting way better now, because there is a lot more attention on the topic. And it kind of gets us too fancy to talk about it. It becomes more, let's say more common, and somehow also it becomes a part of the heart investment criteria of some funds. That, and I think this is overall a good development. But ultimately, I hope that all this is not necessary anymore, because it's just become completely normal. And I don't want anybody to benefit from that trend, who is not ready to give their everything to this, basically to growing a great company. I'm not ready to support people that are not best at. I just don't want to see that they are blocked out.
Lieke 31:08
Yeah, interesting perspective, Juliane, and I think indeed that things are moving towards the right direction. And we also see more and more women in VC such as you, I think that's a positive trend. And so to round off this part of the interview, we would like to ask you, what do you see as an application of blockchain technology that you believe really has a good impact on society? You already mentioned a bit on the peer to peer solutions. Do you have maybe one example of something that makes you really optimistic?
Juliane 31:45
I have to. Basically the entire open finance part. So really having people bank that haven't been bank before. And then to be more concrete. Also, one of our portfolio companies, for example, is working on infrastructure that provides researchers with funding in a democratized way that are researching molecules in the health space to, for example, cancer treatment. So these kinds of early applications I'm very fond of.
Lieke 32:23
Excellent. Yeah, I'm really inspired to hear all these developments. And I'm looking forward to seeing them rolling out. And thanks, Juliane, this was the first part of the interview recording. And now we're gonna move to the second part to the fire round questions. So if you're ready, we're going to start with a couple of really short questions. And if you can just name the first thing that pops up into your minds, then we can go ahead.
Juliane 32:52
Sure, I'm ready.
Lieke 32:53
Cool. What is your morning coffee order?
Juliane 32:57
I have no morning coffee, I drink green tea.
Lieke 32:59
Nice.
Liz 33:00
Perfect. And if you could solve one problem in the world, what would it be?
Juliane 33:08
Violence against people that are weaker.
Lieke 33:14
Okay, and could you name three traits that in your eyes make a successful GP?
Juliane 33:23
Efficiency, quality, and which is also excellent, and having a really head written of team
Liz 33:39
Great and finally, what book are you currently reading?
Juliane 33:45
I'm reading several books. I would choose to name the history of cryptography by silencing.
Liz 33:56
Fantastic, that's a good recommendation. Thanks. All right, Juliane, notice the last part of this fire round. I'm going to mention a couple of topics and can you please tell us what you think only using the words overrated or underrated? Alright. So the first subject I'm asking what you think is overrated or underrated, is Twitter.
Juliane 34:23
Underrated.
Liz 34:24
Elon Musk?
Juliane 34:28
Overrated.
Liz 34:30
Avocados?
Juliane 34:34
Overrated.
Liz 34:36
What about NFT's?
Juliane 34:39
Overrated, definitely.
Liz 34:41
Zoom meetings.
Juliane 34:45
Underrated.
Liz 34:46
Right? Brezels.
Juliane 34:50
Overrated.
Liz 34:51
And finally, what about the theorem?
Juliane 34:58
That's a difficult one. That's a political one for me. I would say overrated because most people don't understand it.
Liz 35:07
Gotcha.
Lieke 35:09
Cool.
Liz 35:10
All right, thank you.
Lieke 35:11
That was it.
Juliane 35:12
Thank you.
Liz 35:13
Thanks so much for your time today. Juliane, we really, really appreciated you. I appreciate you taking the time to describe this really interesting space that I think is on the top of everyone's mind, but perhaps we have a better understanding of it now after listening to your very clear explanations, and also more about yourself.
Juliane 35:32
Thank you for having me, it was a great pleasure
Lieke 35:33
Super insightful.
Thanks Juliane.
Juliane 35:37
Thank you.